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International Tom &Jerry:The Golden Collection Volume 2 (1 Viewer)

FoxyMulder

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Hello everyone.

It’s been a while since I logged in here, a long break, well tonight I bought Tom and Jerry a Volume One on blu ray, I then started looking for Volume 2, I could not find it, I started looking into this, I noted controversy over two of the shorts, so a quick question.

Was volume two ever released?
 

Brent Reid

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Hello everyone.

It’s been a while since I logged in here, a long break, well tonight I bought Tom and Jerry a Volume One on blu ray, I then started looking for Volume 2, I could not find it, I started looking into this, I noted controversy over two of the shorts, so a quick question.

Was volume two ever released?
Hi Malcolm, great to have you back! :)

According to Wikipedia, Volume Two was due in 2013 but postponed indefinitely.
 

FoxyMulder

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I'd prefer it if the postponement/cancellation was more due to underwhelming sales for the first volume, rather than purely because of misplaced PC considerations. I'm sure if it had made a massive profit they'd have said "Publish and be damned."
Yes I agree, it’s just crazy this world, denying the past, trying to censor history, it’s something I despise, yes it may only be animation but what happens if we also try to censor historical fact, aspects of World War Two never happened as one example, it just should not happen.

Okay rant over, disappointed it was not released.
 

WillG

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If I remember this correctly, word got out that a few shorts that would have chronologically been part of a vol 2 would not be included due racial issues. WB got a lot of backlash from fans and they decided not to bother with a release.
 

Dick

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Yes I agree, it’s just crazy this world, denying the past, trying to censor history, it’s something I despise, yes it may only be animation but what happens if we also try to censor historical fact, aspects of World War Two never happened as one example, it just should not happen.

Okay rant over, disappointed it was not released.

This doesn't happen only for animation.
 

Dick

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Just wondering, what other titles?

If you consider re-writing history as a form of censorship (as I do), check out literally any film about Christopher Columbus (there is even a push now to change the Columbus Day holiday to Indigenous American Day); many, many pre-60's westerns depicting Native Americans as the sole villains during the Manifest Destiny period; etc.
 

Nick*Z

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Film is a cultural artifact. It is important that it be preserved and maintained as it reflects time and place, social mores and cultural stereotypes; some to endure, others to languish. You cannot and never should censor film any more than you should consider painting clothes over some of the Rubenesque nudes that hang in the Louvre, fearing more tender eyes will be 'insulted' or 'offended' by the sight of naked flesh. Stereotypes reflect both time and place. Acknowledging their existence is not the same as accepting them as the cultural norm or even tolerating them for the sake of a 'quaint' and 'rose-colored' fondness for another time. It merely makes the statement "There it is. There is was. But this is how far we have come...and perhaps, how much further we have to go." For some reason, film doesn't rate the same classification in this regard when compared to other competing art forms. But it should and it must. Or as an infamous man once correctly stated, "Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it." How true. How sad...and how true.
 

bigshot

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If they hadn't started this as a "complete chronological" series, we would still be getting Tom & Jerry cartoons on blu-ray. Warner Bros is stupid with how they market their cartoon collections. If they want to put together sets that are OK for kids to watch, they shouldn't make sets designed to appeal to fanatic collectors with OCD. They should just mix and match in "cartoon carnival" collections and target young families with kids. That's the way to keep these cartoons in circulation.
 

FoxyMulder

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If you consider re-writing history as a form of censorship (as I do), check out literally any film about Christopher Columbus (there is even a push now to change the Columbus Day holiday to Indigenous American Day); many, many pre-60's westerns depicting Native Americans as the sole villains during the Manifest Destiny period; etc.
I agree, I cannot watch some of those movies featuring native Americans as two dimensional bad guys, many featuring white actors dressed up as Indians, some of them I can watch, such as The Searchers.

I suppose one could argue an action flick like Rambo fighting the Vietnamese army is also the same but I can enjoy those too and distance the war and just take the film as an action flick.

The question is, would you censor or ban these films due to their misleading history or do you allow them?
 

seanrt

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Film is a cultural artifact. It is important that it be preserved and maintained as it reflects time and place, social mores and cultural stereotypes; some to endure, others to languish. You cannot and never should censor film any more than you should consider painting clothes over some of the Rubenesque nudes that hang in the Louvre, fearing more tender eyes will be 'insulted' or 'offended' by the sight of naked flesh. Stereotypes reflect both time and place. Acknowledging their existence is not the same as accepting them as the cultural norm or even tolerating them for the sake of a 'quaint' and 'rose-colored' fondness for another time. It merely makes the statement "There it is. There is was. But this is how far we have come...and perhaps, how much further we have to go." For some reason, film doesn't rate the same classification in this regard when compared to other competing art forms. But it should and it must. Or as an infamous man once correctly stated, "Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it." How true. How sad...and how true.
So true. It’s one of the reasons I love older films. They put history and times in the context of how things were viewed at the time and shows how little has changed when it comes to certain topics. A distinct peek into what life was many years before I came around.
 

Dick

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I agree, I cannot watch some of those movies featuring native Americans as two dimensional bad guys, many featuring white actors dressed up as Indians, some of them I can watch, such as The Searchers.

I suppose one could argue an action flick like Rambo fighting the Vietnamese army is also the same but I can enjoy those too and distance the war and just take the film as an action flick.

The question is, would you censor or ban these films due to their misleading history or do you allow them?

I don't believe in censorship. Films such as those we are speaking about here are important if only because they reflect the attitudes and knowledge of their era. Same is true of (gulp) SONG OF THE SOUTH. I think that keeping these unedited films out of current circulation is tantamount to censorship.
 

bigshot

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Do you know how many films are not in general circulation? What about out of print books? Is all that censorship too?

The problem here is that cartoons are generally marketed to families, not historians. Kids aren't crying out for racial stereotypes in their cartoons and parents probably don't want to buy that sort of thing for them. I think that is probably a good thing. I'd rather have audiences see films as entertainment than historical societal anomalies.
 

B-ROLL

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Do you know how many films are not in general circulation? What about out of print books? Is all that censorship too?

The problem here is that cartoons are generally marketed to families, not historians. Kids aren't crying out for racial stereotypes in their cartoons and parents probably don't want to buy that sort of thing for them. I think that is probably a good thing. I'd rather have audiences see films as entertainment than historical societal anomalies.
Check under the stage for special information ...
74blarge.jpg
 

WillG

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Do you know how many films are not in general circulation? What about out of print books? Is all that censorship too?

I think he's referring to things being kept out of circulation for political reasons. But no, it's not technically censorship.

Take a film like "Song of the South". It's clear there are many who would buy a copy but it's a losing proposition for Disney. It doesn't matter how many disclaimers you put on the package, it doesn't matter if the main feature has an unskippable foreword explaining. Someone out there is going to complain. "Family Friendly" Disney will be accused by the press of releasing a "racist" kids movie (I'd say they should let Criterion release it). Personally I don't see what the big deal is. I'm smart enough to know that SotS is a product of its time and does not reflect society toady. It find it troubling that so many cannot seem to make that distinction (though I do think certain complainers out there are just opportunists)
 

bigshot

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There are thousands of cartoons where there would be no objection to marketing them to children. But Warner Bros seems to think that only collectors are interested in them. That is a huge mistake. As time passes, the cartoons fall out of public consciousness and there are fewer and fewer collectors to sell to. Yet every day there are new children who would love to see these cartoons. They're focused on the ass end of the market.

All they need to do is target the broad market first and serve that. Then every once in a while, do a special disc for collectors that has the odds and ends that don't fit in the general collections. They might have a chance of actually making money that way. I'm a collector myself, but I'd rather have a thriving market for these films than be catered to myself and have them stop dead for lack of sales.

I can tell you that the absolute last thing I want is Song of the South with unskippable apologies before it. It's like those Leonard Maltin introductions on the Disney sets. The best way to kill a movie is to get up and try to make the audience feel ashamed for watching it before the movie even starts.
 

bigshot

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One more thing.... I've been collecting cartoons on video since the beginning of the VHS era. There have always been certain cartoons that aren't easy to get. Notice I said aren't *easy* to get... I bet just about everyone in this thread complaining about Song of the South actually *has* a copy of Song of the South.

There's a point where it crosses the line into fetish. There are certain collectors who keep demanding these cartoons simply because they are deemed "racist". They focus on them way out of proportion. It's a handful of films and they aren't always the best films either. With the amount of truly great animation out there of all kinds, focusing on just the "unacceptable" titles is counter productive. Warner Bros tries to release what they think they can release and they're nailed to a cross for not including a "racist" cartoon. They release a film with a syndication title instead of the first release and people start organizing boycotts. The negative attitude of certain rabid collectors is the real reason why Warner Bros isn't releasing any more cartoons on blu-ray.

"This is why we can't have nice things."
 

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